to have the front of the kirtle kept at the waist or dip below which would be more comfortable and prettier but would risk bending.

a lot is going to depend upon the upcoming hide glue experiment...

veste and other things

ok, so i finally figured out how to get the comments section to show up which turned out to be fairly simple, but i totally redid the blog template before figuring out what the problem was.  so yay.

anyhow, time for another brain dump about this project.  there are lots of little parts, and it's helpful to have them all in one place like this.

the over-all concept is probably something i should go over.  i'm wondering, when a woman woke up on a regular day (aka not a portrait-sitting day) what did she reach for to put on?  i'm looking in the area around florence, which seems to be fairly standard for the area (rome being populated by celibate men, and venice being all up in it's own thing).  the timeline i'm looking at starts with between mid 1500s to the 1640s for the under-dress described below, and in the later 1500s for the veste.  i'm also being under-developed for decorations.  i'll probably do embroidery on the camicia (to be discussed later), and i have lace to use, but

the outer layer i'm going for is the veste.  if you want to know where the hell all this lingo stuff comes from, i'm getting it from this ridiculously helpful site.  there are very few examples of people who have made these - especially like i'm looking at.  oh, and i have yet to seen the ruff done well.  it's a different shape, and i have no idea if it's attached to the camicia (which i may or may not be spelling correctly today) or if it's attached to a partlet.  and people say that the veste was warn without a full dress of a kirtle or whatever underneath, but i'm thinking there must have at least been a corset or something and not just a camicia and then the veste.  well, unless they all had tiny titties that didn't need held up ever at all.  which i doubt. especially since skinny apparently wasn't the desired look like it is now.  Young Boy isn't the most feminine of silhouettes (i'm looking at you, modern fashion designers).

here are some vestes:

maybe laudomia de' Medici by Allori, Alessandro

i think this is actually even the main image i want to work from.  why?  cause i have a bunch of buff fake suede that would work for this.  yeah, i know that in no way whatsoever that's a period fabric, but i own it, so i'm doing it.  so there.  Good Enough and Free are the main concepts in this choice of fabrics.

more vestes:

same guy painting bianca cappello

his portrait of a noble woman

maybe maria de' medici

another random chick

ok, this one is a little overdressed
(and i know hat this site has re-productions, but still interesting and i can image search later)

lucrezia de medici

this might be bianca capello in beautiful buttersccotch

random chick with a nice partlet close-up

who knows but she's associated with the artist

allori's maria de' medici or some other medici - who knows?

chick with a dog (that looks like a cat hybrid somehow) by allori

nice partlet

it is increasingly clear that i need to study allori more since i haven't even gotten past paintings attributed to him on this here post.  hm.

ok, so one from a follower of bronzinio:

no idea yet who did this of eleonora of toledo:

and i think that's enough for now.  hell, i need to go make dinner anyhow.  so... veste.  good times.

and while this site didn't put up all these pictures to figure out the clothing, she has basically the same set as i put up here.  nice.  too bad i didn't find this first.

the base

hi.  i need to organize my thoughts.  so here you go if you're joining me on the journey.

so, i've decided to enter a contest to make historical italian clothing.  oh look, it's here.  it's supposed to go to 1610, but some of the good clothing that i've found has better portrayals in later dates.  so we're composing stuff together here.

i would like to start out with what seems to be the dark-wash, straight-leg jeans of italian women everywhere (or at least in several places for most of the 1500 into the 1600s): the brown sottana (glossary link on left).  so i want to start making that.  while this is from a later date, it's all over.

by  by orazio gentileschi (1563 - 1639):    

two women with a mirror (date unknown)

the madonna

mary magdaline

in reds:

rest on the flight to egypt (1628)

saint cecelia and an angel

lute lady:

lute player (1626)

various possible helps:

finding moses

but this sottana had been around for a while.

jacopo bassiano (1510 - 1592)

the road to calvary, 1575

paolo veronese (1528 - 1588)

st. helena vision of the cross, 1570

caravaggio had them all over the place and surely was in the right timeline i'm looking at.

caravaggio (1571 - 1610)

judith, 1599

st. catherine of alexandria, 1599 (busy year)

and i love this one:

the conversion of mary magdalen, 1598 - 1599

so that's a start.  that's the base garmet and some permutations.  it could be laced under the arms or side back, and i think that i'll pick what seems to be less common and do the side back because it's easier to tie each lace in the back under the skirt.  so.... start.  more later.  but i feel better for having all these in the same place.  yay.